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Politics => Political discussion => Topic started by: sqlbullet on December 16 2020 10:04:54 AM MST

Title: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: sqlbullet on December 16 2020 10:04:54 AM MST
Now is the the time for us to up our game in changing minds and winning hearts.  There is already rhetoric from the incoming administration, and we have to start now to defend out rights, and maybe even advance them.

Facts and logic are NOT your friends in this process.  The backfire effect is huge on emotional issues.  If you start out telling your anti-gun or neutral-gun friends they are wrong by deluging them with facts, logic and constitutional arguments you will get ignored at best and lose your audience (and rights) at worst.

Here are the elements debate we all have to make our first nature if we are to succeed in changing minds.

1. Find common ground first. 

Ask lots of questions.  Get them to talk about their opinion.  Find areas you can agree.  "I agree we need to reduce crime",  "Mental health issues must be addressed",   "Safety is very important to me as well" are examples of easy ways to find common ground.  The idea here is to create a partnership that is going to explore ways to address the issues.  By starting on the same side of real problems we can take away combative dialog that may result in re-enforcing counter-productive opitions.

2. Un-read library

Once you have used Rapoport's Rules to establish common ground, it's time to give them some rope. Start drilling on some points you may not agree with.  Not with facts and counter-arguments, but with follow-up questions.  You want them to expand and explain those points to you.  The bait here is the opportunity for them to show YOU something.  The switch is that in the process they will begin to see their own ignorance about the "facts" they know.  Example:  "You mentioned universal background checks.  Background checks have been required since 1994.  How effective have those been?  How many prohibited people have been prosecuted for trying to buy a gun?  How many citizens have had their rights denied/delayed due to false positives?  Are background checks keeping bad people from getting guns?  How do criminals get guns?". 

DON'T answer these questions for them.  The goal in this segment is not to tell them they are wrong, but to help them realize their own ignorance.  If they do ask you to answer one of these questions avoid the urge to put on your professor hat.  Phrases like "I don't think ...." or "It seems like...." help you remain a partner on equal footing.  People don't like to be wrong or less knowledgeable.

The point here is to create doubt in their own position.  The un-read library is all the things they think they know, but actually don't know about their position.  They need to convince themselves they actually don't know what they thought they did.

3. Get them to argue against themselves

Sometimes called the "scales" we can now create questions that will cause them to quantify their gun control ideas.  "1-10  How effective do you think universal background checks would be at keeping guns from criminals?"  No one will say a 10.  They will say a 7 or an 8.  So our follow up is "Why only a seven?"  They are going to start to tell you the problems and gaps in their own beliefs.

4. Facts hurt, not help, unless they are the right facts at the right time

Facts are like punches.  When you punch them, they will block.  People like coming up with good answers, not being told.

But....At this point if you have executed 1, 2 and 3 well they are ready to discuss other solutions to the problems.

5. Give and take

Be prepared to lose somethings that may be less important than your gun rights.  And be prepared to offer those things to improve your position.

For example, if the conversation turns to income/wealth inequality, I personally have less objection to a UBI than to an AWB.  And I do think a UBI would have a much bigger impact on crime reduction than an AWB.  I would also entertain universal background checks (no registry) in exchange for removing silencers and SBR's from the NFA and re-opening the machine gun registry.

Finally, you can't get mad.  Now matter how willfully ignorant, pig-headed and wrong the person may be, remain calm and collected.  It's OK to agree to disagree.  But losing your cool ensures they won't want to talk to you about it again, even if they someday realize they are wrong and need your advice.
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: Kenk on December 16 2020 10:36:26 AM MST
Good stuff, Thanks!
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: blaster on December 16 2020 04:13:24 PM MST
good advice.  8)
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: terdog on December 17 2020 09:41:18 AM MST
Good points no matter what the subject.
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: Graybeard on December 17 2020 11:43:42 AM MST
"Now what?" I think the NSA just switched all of the members here from the good guys/patriots list to the bad guys list for at least the next 4 years. Be careful what you write.

Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: Edm on January 09 2021 09:45:28 PM MST
I agree with all except the trade deal. What have we gained in the firearms realm ever?  I can't think of anything.  Just more restrictions.  Trades aren't in their playbook.  It's always take.  I may be wrong, but you will have to show me where that has worked.
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: JSutter on January 10 2021 12:04:15 AM MST
They've been telling us, in words and actions, what is next.  They've told us for generations.

Recently, just using the ChiComs virus:
Attending church is illegal
Papers are required to travel
Jobs are sent overseas
Taxes will increase
Empty shelves at the grocery store
Street violence by government protected thugs
Obey without question
No speaking out against the party line
They arrest you as they wish and they control what evidence you can review or present
No weapons, right to assemble, grievance, or private property
Etc

Looks like following the socialist playbook which is a promise they made to us.

They may delay when they're weak but they never quit.
You can vote your way into socialism but fighting is the only way out.

Public school history classes used to teach this stuff, using real world examples.  I lived them conquering CA; my memories go back well over fifty years.
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: Alaska on February 18 2023 07:07:55 PM MST
Now over 2 years into this administration?
What has Joe done right beside spend our Tax money.
Title: Re: So Biden is our new President...Now what?
Post by: blaster on February 19 2023 06:52:44 AM MST
bring the USA from superpower to 3rd World status?