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10mm Ammuntion => Factory 10mm ammo => Topic started by: RRMan03 on April 13 2013 11:59:08 AM MDT

Title: Underwood 220gr HC
Post by: RRMan03 on April 13 2013 11:59:08 AM MDT
Does anyone know what combination of metals are put together to make the hard cast bullets. How much lead is in this bullet?
Title: Re: Underwood 220gr HC
Post by: The_Shadow on April 13 2013 01:23:37 PM MDT
Well that's a good question!  The other is How Hard?

Most consider wheel weights at 10-12 BHN to be hard, others who add other stuff to the alloy like linotype (contains antimony and arsenic) to make them around 16-18.  Some are water quenched to harden and others heat treated to increase hardness!

Pure will run from 6-8 BHN
Straight Linotype is about 22-24 BHN

You can learn more at this website...http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm (http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm)

Hope this helps... :D
Title: Re: Underwood 220gr HC
Post by: RRMan03 on April 13 2013 03:28:22 PM MDT
Thanks Shadow. Just curious who is the bullet maker for Buffalo Bore and Underwood on the HC bullets.
Title: Re: Underwood 220gr HC
Post by: sqlbullet on April 15 2013 05:00:15 PM MDT
Most probably they are 90% lead or more.  It is remotely possible someone is paying for linotype (84/12/4 lead/antimony/tin), but very unlikely.  Especially at Underwood pricing.  Antimony is about $3.50 per lb shipped, where other alloys can be had for under $1.00 per lb shipped.

It is a good bet that both of these outlets are selling water quenched wheel weight alloy.  Clip on wheel weights vary a bunch over time, but generally about about 0.5%-1.0% tin, 1.5%-3.0% antimony, with the balance being lead.  By quenching these in water directly from the mold the bullets become hard, but also less maleable.

Back in the day of Elmer Keith and hot 44 special loads, Elmer cast his hard cast bullets from 16:1 lead:tin.  That works out to 6% tin, 94% lead.  These bullets would not get harder from quenching (antimony or another grain refiner is needed for quenching to work).  I have never tested the alloy myself and have read varying accounts of how hard it is.  The LASC site THe_shadow referenced will tell you they are about an 11.  But others are quick to point out that lead/tin alloys age-soften quickly and will be more like 9 within a few days of casting.  These bullets are more 'tough' than hard, but penetrate very well while offering some expansion.

But, tin is very expensive today opposed to when Elmer was paying for it.  Most guys today find that clip on wheel weights mixed 50/50 with pure lead, and quenched from the mold behave very much like bullets cast from 16:1, but at far, far less cost.

My own alloy of choice is isotope lead, which I have had tested as 96% lead, 3% antimony and 1% tin.  I sell a good bit of this alloy to a local commercial casting company too, and they are very happy with it.

I "sweeten" this with another 1% tin.  The resulting bullets age harden to about BHN 13 when air-cooled, or age soften to about BHN 23 when water dropped.  I generally water drop, and end up with a 200 gr bullet that will punch through 11 milk jugs of water from a 5" 10mm with no expansion.  For my new hollow point mold I will play with both air-cooled and water dropped, but I expect the water dropped to just dump about 50 grains of lead and leave me with a 130 grain round nose that keeps going.  I expect the air-cooled to mushroom nicely and hold together well.

But, I will have to test to see, which is a lot of the fun with casting your own.